But then there was, like, this whole thing with.. When I went.. when I started to get into (with) music. Suddenly, I couldn’t be a fan anymore and just listen. I had to deal with all of those petty envies, you know – “Shit, I could have… if I had that music, I could’ve written better lyrics!”.. or ”You know, he should have paused in that phrase in there. he could’ve gotten (plenty) more power out of that, he should have waited for the power-chords to crash before he hit the rhyme”, you know. And, you know, this thing about “Why is this guy making it? – that song sucks, you know, it’s not that commercial stuff,” you know. I mean, So..
But, after a while you come to peace with that, just as, when you’re a writer, and you just, you know, start to like a lot broader range. Like, when I first read the Don Allen anthology, I had a much shallower range of who I liked in it than I did if I picked it up now. You know,(I think now) I could find something in everybody’s poems there, (something) that I really like. It took me, like, say.. I mean, say – I think, you know…
[John Wieners (1934-2002)]
I loved John Wieners poems so much. And, at first, when I read them, I just didn’t “get” The Hotel Wentley Poems”, in that.. you know.. (And) I had to see (them) later on, (like, from some of (via) his later poems), when his Selected Poems first came out, (in, I think, in 1972, from Grossman) – [Editorial note – a new Selected Poems selection was issued recently (2015) from Wave Books] – You know, I can look back on The Hotel Wentley Poems. I like the later poems more, but, then, he was just creating his own history by that, you know. So, I was going back to The Hotel Wentley Poems and saw the power in them from his later poems.. I mean, that happens all the time. I think it’s like a (Jorge Luis) Borges notion that, you know,Kafka makes.. that he uses an influence that he got from Nathaniel Hawthorne, or something. Then he makes Nathaniel Hawthorne (sense), you know, like using that idea and copying an idea, simply making Nathaniel Hawthorne’s work stronger when you read it – So the future poet provides strength and kind of rewrites the works of the past writers constantly, you know . ( (But) You’ve got to make a few charges here and there, or else…)
But… So I guess the thing to do now, since I’ve been mentioning (Bob) Dylan so much, we’ll play a song, which I think.. –
[To Student/technicial assistant – Well, I’m not going to… I’ll play.. And then I’ll play a Phil Ochs song....]
[Audio for the above can be heard here, beginning at approximately twenty-six minutes in and concluding at approximately thirty-three-and-three-quarter minutes in]